cheese questions, waxing vs bandaging, drying, aging?

[mtcowgirl]

Ok so I am attempting to do hard cheeses again.

I have done two Havarti's. One I completely forgot about the soaking in water and brine. So it just ended up air drying for 2-3 days and then I put it in my cellar at 45-50 degrees and about 70%ish humidity. I have been flipping it at least once a day and sometimes twice, and washing it down it brine every few days or when I remember.

Second cheese I remembered the soaking. It is now drying. How long should I let it dry for? What does the rind need to look like? IT is almost yellow but I can still press it a little, so it is not hard.

First question when do I wax it, or do I. It hasn't developed a realy hard rind, like a hard surface, more of a hard leathery feel I'd say. Also I was looking up bandaging and noticed several of you on here that do it instead of the wax. And that has me totally intrigued. I have lots of ghee and butter and was wondering if I could use this? Also should I be wiping the fat on the cheese every few days or what? lew92 I think I saw a few posts where you were doing this, and I know there was a few others can't remember them right now.

Also I have a farmhouse cheddar in the press. I did a 10 pound weight, then I did a twenty, right now I have it under a 90lb weight, I know that is too high it was only supposed to be 50 for 12hours. But since it is 90 should I just do less time on it?


Also how do you identify your cheeses? Do you write on them, stick a piece of tape on them, tape beside them in the box. My hubby built me a drying/aging box with shelves in it that has screened sides for airflow and to keep the passing rodent out, that I have them in, in the cellar.

Any thoughts or suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks

[lew92]

With that leathery rind, I wouldn't bother with bandaging, waxing or vacuum sealing them. Keep an eye on it and if it looks like it is getting dry, then you can either bandage or just rub with lard or ghee, which is what I do now.

I would still use bandaging on cheeses that are intended to age for a really long time - like a cheddar that I wanted to age out for 18 months or more. But it will grow mold on it, so be prepared for that. Just wipe the mold off or use a soft brush (think like a "dandy" brush for horses to slick up their coats) to remove the most obnoxious growth, but no need to try to remove all the color.

With the leathery rinds that I notice some dryness, I just rub a coating of lard or ghee on it. If the coating cracks, I put on more fat. But I don't have to do that very frequently. Maybe 2-4 weeks from the first coating? I place the cheeses on paper plates to help contain some of the mess.

I use snack-sized zip top bags with slips of paper to identify my wheels of cheese. I write the date I took the cheese out of the mold, the variety of cheese and any unusual steps in the make (like the Havarti you forgot to soak in brine). I note when I am seeing mold formation or dryness or the leathery "skin" along with the dates of any cares I perform, such as removing excess mold.

On the bottom of the back side of the slip of paper, I note the aging time in weeks or months, then the dates when the cheese will be properly aged. It helps me remember when I should crack it open.

All of the notes help me with different outcomes than expected so I can repeat them if I really like them.

Make sure to keep a thermometer in the area where you have your cheese cabinet. It would be best to have one that will note high and low temperatures and I would keep twice daily notations of the readings you are getting. You don't want that area getting any higher than 55*F (best to be below 50*F). But if you don't have good monitoring equipment, you won't know.

Best of luck with your cheesemaking venture!

[lew92]

Oh, I keep the zipped bags with notes in them either on top of or right next to the cheeses in my cave so I know which wheel the notes go with.

As for your cheddar, I'd go ahead and leave it under the heavier pressure for the full time frame. It should be knit really well. It will likely be dryer, too, but has great potential for a long-aged cheese.

How big are your wheels, weight-wise? Or even easier: How many gallons of milk do you use to make a wheel?

[justonecow]

I can't answer all your questions, but I will answer the ones I can. For the 90 lb cheese in the press, I would do a shorter press time than if you were using 50 otherwise it might make it too dry. For identifying cheese I wax all my hard cheeses so I just use either a piece if masking tape or a piece of paper and write the name of the cheese and the date on that. I then either dab some wax around the edges of the label or if it's the tape I will just dip the cheese in the wax and coat the tape too...does that make sense?

Hope you have some great success w/your cheese making!!!

[justonecow]

I just realized lew92 was answering the same time I was.  She says to let it press for the full time and I say shorter time so you just have to decide, lol.  She has probably made a lot more cheese than I so it won't hurt my feelings if you go w/what she said.

Also, the date I write on my cheese is the day I wax it, not the day it is made that way when I go to get a cheese I can do some quick math to decide if I feel it has been long enough.  I am not a real stickler for time length, but I like to wait 30 days min. hoping for 60 or longer.

[Kelsey]

I'll confuse you even more!
Most recipes should give a psi for pressing. If it just says 50# for the whole cheese, what was the given size for the wheel? Is yours bigger or smaller?

Anyway, the press weight doesn't matter too much once you get up past 30# or so. The length of pressing affects the acidity of the cheese more than anything (longer time = more acidic) so keep that in mind.

[treatlisa]

I use the ghee/lard method and apply it only once (after drying a couple of days) and press a blue painters tape label onto the side (into the coating of the cheese) with date, kind and quick notes about make. I use wax paper squares (Costco) one on top, one on bottom to keep the ghee/lard contained but still have access to the label. I keep a binder with paper in plastic sheet protectors and I wash and press the blue tape notes on to when I open the cheese. I add notes on the paper (next to the label) about date opened, taste and other characteristics about the cheese when I open it. I have collected quite a few pages of notes that have been helpful as I have progressed in my cheesemaking. I don't know how long I will keep the old notes but they are kind of fun to look back over for now.

It's not a perfect method, the wax paper gets partially broken down over time with the mold, but it keeps everything contained enough for the aging of the cheese, then it gets trimmed off with the lard when I open the cheese. I have a great cheese knife (Cutco) that helps with the messy (but very rewarding!) trim of the latest cheese.

I'm super excited for my cow to freshen in May so I can start again!

Have fun putting together your own system that works for you and enjoy your cheese.

[lew92]

treatlisa, can you share a link to the knife you use?

My cow is set to freshen in May, too. I really need to stock up on cheeses again so I won't get a foster calf for awhile.

It is fun to read how everyone has different methods to keep track of their cheeses.

[mtcowgirl]

Apr 8, 2016 21:52:32 GMT -5 lew92 said:

With that leathery rind, I wouldn't bother with bandaging, waxing or vacuum sealing them. Keep an eye on it and if it looks like it is getting dry, then you can either bandage or just rub with lard or ghee, which is what I do now.

I would still use bandaging on cheeses that are intended to age for a really long time - like a cheddar that I wanted to age out for 18 months or more. But it will grow mold on it, so be prepared for that. Just wipe the mold off or use a soft brush (think like a "dandy" brush for horses to slick up their coats) to remove the most obnoxious growth, but no need to try to remove all the color.

With the leathery rinds that I notice some dryness, I just rub a coating of lard or ghee on it. If the coating cracks, I put on more fat. But I don't have to do that very frequently. Maybe 2-4 weeks from the first coating? I place the cheeses on paper plates to help contain some of the mess.

I use snack-sized zip top bags with slips of paper to identify my wheels of cheese. I write the date I took the cheese out of the mold, the variety of cheese and any unusual steps in the make (like the Havarti you forgot to soak in brine). I note when I am seeing mold formation or dryness or the leathery "skin" along with the dates of any cares I perform, such as removing excess mold.

On the bottom of the back side of the slip of paper, I note the aging time in weeks or months, then the dates when the cheese will be properly aged. It helps me remember when I should crack it open.

All of the notes help me with different outcomes than expected so I can repeat them if I really like them.

Make sure to keep a thermometer in the area where you have your cheese cabinet. It would be best to have one that will note high and low temperatures and I would keep twice daily notations of the readings you are getting. You don't want that area getting any higher than 55*F (best to be below 50*F). But if you don't have good monitoring equipment, you won't know.

Best of luck with your cheesemaking venture!

Thank you so much this helps. I think I'll go find some ziplock baggies and paper, and then maybe a note book to keep the slips in when I am done with them.

So how much butter or ghee should I put on these wheels if I need to? Are we talking a thin layer, or globs of it,or thick layer?

[mtcowgirl]

Apr 8, 2016 21:54:53 GMT -5 lew92 said:

Oh, I keep the zipped bags with notes in them either on top of or right next to the cheeses in my cave so I know which wheel the notes go with.

As for your cheddar, I'd go ahead and leave it under the heavier pressure for the full time frame. It should be knit really well. It will likely be dryer, too, but has great potential for a long-aged cheese.

How big are your wheels, weight-wise? Or even easier: How many gallons of milk do you use to make a wheel?

The cheeses are weighing a little over three pounds taken out of the mold. I am doing roughly 4 gallons of milk at a time, maybe a hair more.

[lew92]

With that size, I think your cheddar will be just fine. It may age a bit more quickly with the heavier press.

I cover the wheels with ghee/lard to the thickness of what I spread peanut butter on a sandwich. What I would consider a "medium" coating. It seems that much of it soaks into the leathery rind over time and it really has reduced the amount of loss I had to dryness.

[mtcowgirl]

So I just took the farmhouse cheddar out of the mold about 9pm last night, put it in about lunch time. So not quite 12 hours of pressing time. Probably only 8 or so. It looked good. But this afternoon when I checked it I noticed it was wet , upon a closer look , it looks like it has cracked a few different places and the 'whey" is leaking out. I can't put it back in the press can I? Is it no good now, do I have to toss it? Please tell me no, I just spent that entire morning in the kitchen with the thing.

[mtcowgirl]

So all this mold that you guys are talking about, kinda seriously is grossing me out. I saw a picture on here posted a couple years ago of someones cheese covered in a huge layer of mold, then they took a picture of each step as they unwarpped, took the mold off, and then trimmed away. Amazing difference. The end product certainly looks edible , but the first one sure didn't. I've always heard don't eat moldy cheese, even if youu cut it off, it still has "tenticals" into the cheese. Of course that was store bought cheese, but stilll........ You all are obviously still alive, so could we talk a bit about it. What am I missing, is it truly safe, not moldy or dangerous underneath all of that.

[lew92]

First of all, your cracked cheese. How cracked is it? Were the curds warm when you put them in the mold? With cheddar, it is very dry, so it is sometimes difficult to get the curds to knit well. I generally put the pot in a sink of warm water with a lid on the pot for a few minutes to warm the curds back up again before packing them into the mold. You could try warming the wheel in a kettle in a similar way, then put it back in to press, but no guarantees.

If it doesn't come together, crumble it up a bit and use it for fresh cheese curds, which are heavenly.

Mold on an aging cheese is different, though. Because it is part of the flora that develops the flavor, texture, and other nuances in the cheese. The molds will be different in different locations and are what contribute to a specific cheese factory's specialty in cheeses because it can't be recreated elsewhere.

I do remove much of the mold as my cheeses age, simply because I have horrible mold allergies. I adore blue cheese and made one batch of it that turned out fantastic, but I suffered throughout the make and won't try it again. I try to keep on top of the mold and scrape it off or use a vinegar and salt paste to scrub it off, just for the sake of my sinuses. I know that I am sacrificing some finer quality by doing so, but that's where I am at.

And I do cut the mold off store cheese and eat the rest anyway. I think rumors like that are started by the manufacturers so that people will throw it away and buy more.

[mtcowgirl]

Apr 9, 2016 17:38:07 GMT -5 lew92 said:

First of all, your cracked cheese. How cracked is it? Were the curds warm when you put them in the mold? With cheddar, it is very dry, so it is sometimes difficult to get the curds to knit well. I generally put the pot in a sink of warm water with a lid on the pot for a few minutes to warm the curds back up again before packing them into the mold. You could try warming the wheel in a kettle in a similar way, then put it back in to press, but no guarantees.

If it doesn't come together, crumble it up a bit and use it for fresh cheese curds, which are heavenly.

Mold on an aging cheese is different, though. Because it is part of the flora that develops the flavor, texture, and other nuances in the cheese. The molds will be different in different locations and are what contribute to a specific cheese factory's specialty in cheeses because it can't be recreated elsewhere.

I do remove much of the mold as my cheeses age, simply because I have horrible mold allergies. I adore blue cheese and made one batch of it that turned out fantastic, but I suffered throughout the make and won't try it again. I try to keep on top of the mold and scrape it off or use a vinegar and salt paste to scrub it off, just for the sake of my sinuses. I know that I am sacrificing some finer quality by doing so, but that's where I am at.

And I do cut the mold off store cheese and eat the rest anyway. I think rumors like that are started by the manufacturers so that people will throw it away and buy more.

THanks lew92, appreciate your help. The cheese has a pretty good inch+ crack and a couple of smaller ones, and then almost liek some pinholes where liquid is weeping out of them. The curds weren't super warm when I put them in the mold. Maybe that was the problem. I guess maybe I'll just crumble it up or slice it and let the boys have it. They'll eat anything if you call it cheese.

Thanks for letting me know what you do with the mold. Guess I'll kinda just see what happens with this cheese, so far neither one of the havarti's have developed any. Of course I've been washing them down witht the salt brine everyt few days so I imagine that helps. Are there any "really bad" molds that one has be aware of?

[lew92]

Black mold is the only one I can think of that is really dangerous but I've never heard of it on cheese before. I know there are a couple of others that are unsavory, but can't think of them off the top of my head. You can look on CheeseForum.org, as there is a LOT of info there.

It sounds to me as though your cheese didn't get cooked enough, so was holding onto moisture that the weight of the press wasn't enough to expel. Don't be hard on yourself, though, as it takes time and a lot of cheesemaking to gain the experience to know when each step is ready to move on to the next one.

I completely gave up on cheddars for 2 years until I was more familiar with easier and shorter aged cheeses before I went back to it. It was time and experience that was well worth it.