Please let me in - pretty please?

[Mitra]

On New Year's Day, Sophie got out of her area and came walking up to the house. She's big and sweet and it was relatively easy to get back to where she was supposed to be. That night I told DH "Tomorrow I just want to let her out of her area and let her hang out with Helen. Maybe since they are both lonely, they'll hit it off and we can just leave Sophie's pen area open so she can come into the barnyard whenever she wants." This would include being able to go into the barn.

The next morning DH let Sophie out of the pig area when he was doing chores. She was only too happy to follow him back into the barnyard. Helen was locked in her stanchion and he wanted to milk so we decided it would be best to close the barn door during milking. Anyone who knows about Helen, knows she likes things "just so" and we try to accommodate her as much as possible. So Sophie got to explore the barnyard which she was happy to do but then she decided she REALLY wanted in the barn. She could hear DH in there talking to Helen and she was sure she was missing out. She started to investigate ways to get in.













She bit the barn, she heaved on the barn, she tried to snout the door out of her way but nothing worked. She gave up for a bit and went to investigate Helen's hay feeder.



Finally DH was done with milking and he opened the barn door. Sophie was thrilled and went right in. She proceeded to explore. Helen was still in her stanchion.

Note the height of their respective backs



Helen has gone to a lot of trouble to get her stall/bed set up just so. Sophie immediately started snouting through the hay and shavings and rearranging Helen's bedroom furniture. Uh oh. Then she pee'd like there was no tomorrow into the very center of Helen's stall nest. Uh oh.

We let Helen out of her stanchion and Sophie immediately came up to her to sniff. Helen's ears went back and she trotted out of the barn. Sophie followed. She just wanted to be where Helen was. Helen went out to her hay feeder (ears never came back forward). Sophie followed her out there. Helen didn't want the pig near her so she trotted back to the barn. Sophie followed. She never acted aggressively toward Helen, just wanted to get close.

When Helen came back out of the barn I had a feeling that there was going to be trouble. She was obviously annoyed. Sophie was very persistent and continued to follow her. Helen had had enough. She turned and put her head down low and shook it really hard at Sophie. Sophie stopped and stared at her for a couple of seconds but then decided to advance again. Helen shook her head at her again but Sophie did not heed the warning. Helen charged forward and pushed Sophie so hard that she lost her balance and got completely bowled over. She let out a good pig squeal and got away as fast she could. I can only describe the look on Sophie's face as one of hurt feelings. She stood there for a long time, looking very forlorn at this turn of events. Helen just looked disgusted. She went into the barn and lay down. We decided that it wouldn't be safe to leave them alone in the barnyard, so DH tricked Sophie back into her pig area. She went from "hurt" to "betrayed". I felt bad for her because she hadn't done anything to deserve this treatment. I also felt bad about her having that taste of freedom and the barnyard, only to be banished again to her lonely pig area. DH had to leave for out-of-state work the next day so we decided that we'd keep the cow and pig separated until he returns in about 8 days.

I definitely want to try again because I know there's the potential for a good relationship between these two large and lonely animals. Don't you think Helen will come around?

What I'm not sure about is whether I want Sophie to have access to the barn. She's just too destructive. It didn't occur to me that the dirt floor of the barn would be so appealing to Sophie. DUH! Everything is frozen solid and covered with snow outside but in the barn there's a veritable gold mine of dirt

Management of the animals always keeps things fresh and exciting!

[marie-in-CA]

I'm feeling sorry for Sophie, but Helen obviously isn't "ready" for a piggy playmate. Sounds as if they are both doing some territorial-related behaviors. Wouldn't want either one of them to be injured and certainly NOT any of their caretakers either!

Helen didn't mind her visit to Sophie's area but not vice versa.

Could you give Sophie some time in the barnyard if Helen's in the barn with the door shut? Or would Helen still be not be OK with that? How are Lulu and Sophie together?

Might be better to wait until Max comes back in case there's some rodeo-ing to do.

Just be careful, OK?

Your biggest fan,

[Janene]

Wow--the second to the last picture I realized how big she was standing next to the gate.
She's pretty!!
I don't know, maybe sweet talk Helen?? Bribe her?? It's hard to change those ol' gals minds....you have to make them think it's *their idea* to be accepting. Hmmmm.......
Janene

PS I think Sophie would LOVE to re-arrange some barn dirt for you....she'd be in hoggy heaven with it being winter and all....

[hazelsmilker]

Awwww, that Helen; she has her rules! No stalking by red swine! I suspect that Sophie is smart enough to learn Helen's rules if you were to introduce her gradually. The barn floor though is probably irrestible to Sophie.

My Jersey steer Stewie, now at 11 months, and my gilt Sally, now about 400 pounds, have been living together for most of the last 6+ months. They were put together originally back in May when Sally was a little weaner. Sally adored Stewie from the beginning, and he initially was the one in charge. He demonstrated this by mounting her constantly. She was oblivious to this behavior as her back didn't come up to his chest. We separated them for about a month in October after Sally's back leg was slightly injured. (We think that Stewie might have stepped on it.) When they were put back together again the tables had turned. No more mounting. Sally pushes Stewie out of the way at will; she makes her nest in the nicest spot with the cleanest straw, and generally rules the roost. This has worked well for us, but it might be because both Sally and Stewie were young and lonely animals. Sally goes to the butcher next week. We'll see how much Stewie misses her.

[Tricia]

Molly took exception to pigs when she first saw them a few years ago. The pigs were housed in what had been the calf house in the barn yard. They had an outside yard to learn electric fence. Well one day Molly wandered into the barnyard from one of the pastures. Well, you'd think she had gone rabid! She paced, she ran, she bellered, her ears were back, she made the most awful bellering sounds. The poor huge full udder flopping away. I ran over with a stick and halter to find out what was going on. Molly ran up to me and bellered in my face, ran back to the pig fence, bellered, by then she is foaming at the mouth and all sweaty. Now Molly is pretty laid back so this is so not here. It took me a bit to get her haltered and out of there. After milking I took her out to pasture, she quickly headed for the barnyard and started going at the pigs again. The pigs were pretty curious but quickly got bored and went back to work tilling up weeds. I ended up closing the gates and putting up a temp. fence to keep Molly away from there. She really hated those things something fierce. NOW, she is fine watching the pigs, she has been known to sniff over their wire at the food troughs but hasn't figured out how to get in.
Poor Helen getting stalked by an adoring red pig. That must have been a sight, a 400 lb pig going rolling.
Gee I think you need a goat or two to make things even more interesting!

[lisanh]

My Ella Mae HATES the pigs. If they get out (and oh how they've been getting out lately) I know it because Elly bellows long and loud, right outside my window until I come out to see, no matter what time it is. I keep telling her she should use her horns to help me herd the pigs, but she refuses, no matter how wimpy I tell her she is.

This is what she looked like the last time the pigs got into her pasture:



I told her she was a wuss. She and the sheep were all afraid of the pigs, poor things.

[kellyj]

Hi Mitra - I love the pics -I think you have a children's story in the makings - and they make me want a pig - she is cute!

I'd follow my gut on whether or not to try socializing them again. I bought goats thinking that once the steer was out of the picture they'd keep Shasta company. From the get-go all Shasta wanted to do was kill them. She turned from the sweetest, calmest girl into NASTY! She'd try stomping on them, she'd head butt them against the wall, just the sight of them put her into a frenzy. She truly wanted to kill them.

To make a long story short - I don't have goats now. I tried penning them well away from Shasta when I left the house - they escaped (from doubled up goat mesh , the little buggers climbed fences like ladders), one got bloat (overeating greenery, I assume) and died - I returned the other to his owner. It was all really awful - the animal control officer found my goats before I did - he made me feel like I was trying to kill my own goats when in fact my intention was opposite.

All this to say that from day one I KNEW keeping goats and a cow on my small property wasn't going to work, I should have listened to myself and Shasta not to everyone else.

You know Helen and know what kind of energy she put into 'tipping' Sophie. From reading the entry it doesn't sound like she was really aggressive, more like she was annoyed and drew a strong boundary line. Go with YOUR gut!

Best of luck, Kelly

[Selden]

No suggestions but what gorgeous animals and what a beautiful barn!

[Christine]

Helen has personality, that's for sure!

She's SOOO Jersey!

Kip

[Jessika]

Wow! She looks bigger than some of my 3-4 year old sows. I never wanted the pigs near my cows, didn't want them urinating on their hay or to ever risk needing to clean pig poop off an udder! She would definitely do a number on the dirt floor, THAT's for sure. My cows dislike the pigs and my theory is that the docile cow knows that pigs are omnivores and would be a danger to her calf during birth, and remember reading somewhere when I first got pigs not to let them in with cows because pigs would damage a cows vulva rooting at it when the cow is laying down. They certainly do root at each others, can you imagine the look of violation on Helen's face if that were attempted? I'll be interested to see how it works out!
Jessika
P.S. Pig, Cow and Barn look great! Zoie enjoyed the pics! Is Sophie bred?

[Mitra]

Really Jessika?! Bigger than some of your 3-4 year old sows!!!?? Does bigger mean "too fat"? She is really tall

No, she's not bred yet. I have not had an easy time getting a hold of Tamworth semen, so I am now going to try and get Duroc semen. We will try to AI her next month.

Even before I read your post about "rooting their vulvas" (YIKES), we've decided to keep them permanently separated. We will have to figure out how to get Sophie some companionship some other way. Helen seem perfectly happy to be a solitary bovine and enjoys her chicken groupies, of which she has many.

[missevelyn]

Chicken groupies. Snort, choke, ROTFLOL! That is just so accurate about any species of groupie.

Regina

[Lannie]

Mitra, your barn is beautiful (as well as the animals), but I want to know how come you don't have poop all over the walls? My new cow barn is completely wallpapered now, including the doors and part of the window (don't ask me how it got up THERE!).

~Lannie

[Jessika]

Really Tall, Mitra! She looks great please let me know how A.I. goes. Maybe a steer for company, once he gets past the edible size ?

[tassie]

Mitra, Sophie has won my heart . What a character.

Trina

PS I still smile whenever I see your avatar ;D ;D ;D