Bailey finally blew! Pics ! :)

[Stacy]

Well, Mike was gone. Of course. He only works nights so few times a year. We had two pigs due..he was on nights.
Ccolllddd nights at that!

Bailey finally gave birth. I went out and it was a mess. She had four piglets on her and six about as far from her in the pen as possible and sooo cold. My son jumped in the pen and took a board and passed me the piglets one by one. We brought in five live ones and left one dead one that was in the farthest corner because she was getting upset. It looks to be pretty small.

We put the piglets in the house and on a towel with a heater blowing at them. I went back and checked again..and again..and again! She gave birth to two dead ones. I know they were dead because they were still covered in blood and never moved one bit from where she had them. They were kinda smallish. The last one also had a big bunch of afterbirth with it. The second to the last one had another pile of afterbirth with it.

We got one piglet put back out with mama pretty quick. Tried a second one but it just sat there shivering so back in it came. I started to defrost some cow colostrum I've had in the freezer for a while to give them. We were so sure two of them were just about gonners... They were gasping for breaths and stiff.
Well, by the time I got the colostrum good and warm, two piglets were up and walking around. We put them back out, they got straight onto teats and are good to go now. The other two, that were gasping are still in here. They are no longer gasping for breaths, not squealing either though. One was half trying to walk when the other two more lively ones were still in here. Shain called him "Lucky" because he just didn't think he'd make it.
I'm going to keep Lucky and the other one in here till Mike gets home around 2:30 or so and see if we can finally get them out on mama.

All told, that made fifteen piglets, two born dead, one that was small but was alive at some point and got very far from mama, the other dead one was probably pretty much frozen to death. It was a good sized pig. I wouldn't be surprised if it was the first one born and had been out there wandering around the longest.
Two of the four dead ones were boys, one girl and one unknown for now. Out of the five in the house, three boys, two girls. I don't know about the rest right now on those either.

Seems like when she was done laboring, she made sure they were all under the heat lamp and is being a real good mama to them. I'll keep checking over the next hour and a half till Mike gets home to make sure none wander away from her again, but I think now that they KNOW where she's at..and more importantly, the milk bar is at, they won't go anywhere just yet.

I hate finding the flaws in our "plans" the hard way and at the expense of lives.

And as for that "snuggle" thing we all talked about on the other thread about these cute lil' piglets... lemme tell you.. piglet wrapped in a warm towel, trying to give it colostrum... Oh gee.. cute! BUT THE SCREETCHING IS NOT SO CUDDLY AND CUTE!!!

[Jerseylady*Heather*]

Oh my goodness. That sounds like when my dog decided to crawl under the deck and have puppies in the middle of a blizzard. At least you were there and knew what to do, probably saved those little piggies. I'll bet they are cute. Congrats on all the babies. Sounds like a lot of work but a lot of fun.

[Stacy]

Thanks Heather! (I had to ask Janene what to do! LOL)
The last two in the house, for anyone wandering after reading the first part are in the dog box still and going out in about a half hour. They are walking now, looking for food, I think! They should be fine when they get out there and on mama.
Whew!!

[Selden]

Great job, Stacy!
I must say it's wonderful to have friends here who understand the joys and difficulties of being covered with blood and amniotic fluid and trying to forcefeed some tiny infant who is doing his best to die! The successes are very sweet.

[Mitra]

What awesome pig Mamas you have! Congrats to Bailey and her human family

[rezzfullacres]

Sounds like an interesting night was had by all and some knowledge was gained.......She had 15 piglets that is fantastic, but it would have been hard for her to raise that many....Her momma usually had 12-14 and averaged raising 13 over 10 farrowings....So now you have 21 piglets wait till they all get in one group and escape into the yard....You and the kids will have a blast piglets are the most amusing animals in the barnyard.......What color breakdown did she have??? I was just wondering how dominate the red is as her momma was red/orange, boar is red her sire was white...Do they all have wattles??? Congratulations to you and the kids for stepping up and getting it done, GREAT JOB!!!!!

[tammy0518]

congrats stacy. you did awesome and were quick to step in. the first babies are always a learning curve. i hope all is going well now

[sherrye]

stacey, what a fine mama you are. we are expecting our first litter very soon too. glad most are ok. let us know how it goes. happy days sherrye

[Lesli]

Congrats on the babies, sorry for your losses. But you still got a pretty good litter. Two sets days apart! You have more than 20 piglets! Yay!

Lesli

[Stacy]

We are back down to 20, or about to be. We have to put one down. I wondered how to do it, if anyone can tell me? She stepped on the leg of one and broke it pretty good. If it was just the lower knuckle, I'd still try and raise him to a BBQ size, but it's the whole thing pulled out, up towards the ham. The leg is already going cold just below that top bone, I guess it'd be a pelvis bone? I don't know bone structure really well.

The four dead ones were all reddish Steve. They were also all boys, it turns out. This broken legged one is reddish too and male too. I haven't taken an exact count on which is white and which is reddish (I say reddish because for instance, the one Shain named Lucky has black spots all over it as well as it being red). Her piglets weren't born as large as Rose's actually.

So if anyone knows how to put a piglet down the best possible way, please let me know?

[IvyHillAcresFarm]

oooh, I am so sorry to hear that. I do not have any info to help, but sending lots of hugs

[Lesli]

Stacy I am so sorry you have to do this, but I guess it is part of life. Here is an article I found and if you scroll down a good ways it says that blunt trauma is the method most used on piglets. It is quick and that is the best thing I guess for something like this. I would definitely not let the others or Baily see you do it. I am so sorry.

Euthanizing Pigs Can be Tough But Necessary

By Kelli Gunderson, Livestock Editor
Friday, January 7, 2005 9:44 AM CST



Larry Firkins admits pig euthanasia is not his favorite topic.

A veterinarian and associate professor at the University of Illinois' College of Veterinary Medicine, Firkins spoke during an Illinois Farrowing Conference last month in Springfield, Ill.

"Euthanasia can be a sensitive subject," Firkins said. Producers are often faced with tough decisions on whether or not to euthanize pigs, as well as how to do so humanely, economically, and in a way that has the least adverse effect on the person performing the euthanasia. This last consideration is one that producers might tend to overlook, Firkins said.

"Think about whether anybody has ever asked you how you feel about euthanizing pigs, or, if someone else is doing the euthanizing, if you've ever talked to them about it," Firkins said. He encouraged producers to talk openly about their feelings on the topic.


"Touch base with those who are performing euthanasia and talk with them about how they're dealing with it," Firkins said. Different people will cope with the task of euthanasia in different ways. A study that surveyed animal control personnel who were required to euthanize pets on a daily basis showed that many dealt with the stress of performing euthanasia by avoiding animal contact beforehand, avoiding discussion of their job duties, using sarcasm when speaking of the animal or owner, and even turning to alcohol or exercise. The same kind of coping strategies might be used by swine producers charged with the job of euthanizing pigs.

"Most producers don't enjoy the task of euthanasia," Firkins said. "We spend our lives trying to help alleviate pain for animals, and then, at times, we're asked to put them down. I don't think we're designed as people to have that as our job."


One way to help alleviate the stress of euthanasia is to develop a complete euthanasia action plan for a farm, Firkins said. Such a plan would include specific euthanasia protocol to be followed when any pig is sick or injured on the farm. The protocol, Firkins said, allows for less guilt on the part of the person doing the euthanizing.

"The benefit of having a protocol is that there's a specific cut-off point," Firkins said. "At some point, the decision is no longer the producer's. Instead, it becomes an issue of following protocol." The National Pork Board's Swine Welfare Assurance Program, for example, suggests a euthanasia action plan in which, except for special circumstances for animals under veterinary care, no more than two days of intensive care with no pig improvement or prospect of pig improvement be allowed before a decision about euthanasia is made. Such a plan clearly points to two days as the maximum amount of time an animal would be allowed to suffer before being euthanized, thus taking some of the decision-making pressure off the shoulders of the producer.

While a two-day time frame may or may not work for every farm, every farm should come up with a specific time allotment, Firkins said. This allows producers enough time to consider euthanasia as well as other options, such as treating a sick or injured pig, slaughtering it, or selling or transferring it. Factors to be considered here include whether there's an appropriate, economical and potentially successful medical treatment available, whether the pig is suitable for transport and human consumption, and whether it has a better chance of improving on a different farm or in a different setting. In the end, the pig's welfare should be the producer's main concern, Firkins said. And, indeed, in some cases, euthanasia may be the best decision.

If the decision is made to euthanize a pig, a producer then needs to decide which method to use. The National Pork Board's list of options for pig euthanasia include gunshot, captive bolt, electrocution, anesthetic, blunt trauma and carbon dioxide.

When considering these methods, it's important to consider not just the distress to the pig, but also the practicality of the method, the technical skills needed to perform it, the cost, and the risk to human safety. Anesthetics, for example, may not be economical or, in some cases, safe. "Vets are not likely to leave enough anesthetic with a producer to drop an old boar because it'd probably be enough to do quite a bit of harm to a person too," Firkins explained.

Electrocution can be a very effective method of euthanasia, but only if done right. "The current needs to go across the brain to render the animal unconscious first, and then from head to anus or head to vulva to stop the heart from beating," Firkins said. Electrocution can also cause the animal to kick, which can put nearby humans in danger.

Blunt trauma is also a concern for Firkins. Although he described it as "by far the most common method of euthanizing piglets," it "looks terrible, and many people don't like doing it," he said. He uses his 17-year-old daughter's perceived reactions to different euthanasia methods as a gauge for measuring their appropriateness in the industry. "I'm not sure that blunt trauma is something I could explain very well to my daughter, or to the general public," Firkins said. "That's probably not something we want our industry to be known for."

Considering these factors, Firkins felt most comfortable suggesting captive bolt, gunshot, and carbon dioxide to producers as the euthanasia methods of choice.

Euthanasia via carbon dioxide causes death due to respiratory arrest, Firkins explained. This method is especially useful for young pigs that can be easily contained in a small container, he said. In most cases, all that's needed is a carbon dioxide tank with a valve and a hose, along with a container such as a garbage can. Pigs to be euthanized can be placed inside a garbage bag inside the can, along with the hose from the tank. The tank valve is turned on, and carbon dioxide fills the can. Firkins noted that it's a good idea not to seal the lid of the can completely. This allows some air to escape from the top of the can while carbon dioxide sinks to the bottom, where it will best affect the pigs. Exposing pigs to a 60- to 70-percent concentration of carbon dioxide for 5 minutes appears to be adequate to cause death. Once the pigs have been euthanized, the producer can simply open the lid, tie the garbage bag, pull the bag from the can and dispose of the pigs. "It's a safe and relatively inexpensive method of euthanasia," Firkins said.

Another good option for euthanasia is the captive bolt gun, which stuns or kills an animal via concussive force by bolt penetration into the brain. Firkins called himself "a pretty big fan of captive bolt guns, as long as they're used and cleaned properly." The proper way to position a captive bolt gun is to hold it at the point where two lines drawn across the animal's forehead - from an eye to the opposite ear - would cross. The gun should also be aimed down, rather than horizontally, in order to assure penetration into the brain, Firkins noted. One word of caution for producers who choose to use captive bolt guns is that the bolt might only stun rather than kill large pigs, such as adult boars. "If it only stuns them, you may need to cut the carotid or brachial artery (on either side of the neck and under the armpit, respectively) to finish the job," Firkins said.

Just as with captive bolts, gunshots need to be properly placed for minimal discomfort to the pig and maximum safety to humans. With guns, "ricochet is a big deal," Firkins said. He spoke from experience, having been in a situation in which a stray bullet meant for an ailing sow ended up ricocheting past him and two other men in a cement-sided farrowing house. "We were planning to shoot the sow, drag her out of the crate and do an emergency c-section," Firkins explained. However, the man holding the snare around the sow's head sneezed just as the other man shot. The gunshot hit the sow, but in the nose rather than the brain, and the stray bullet "ricocheted past us probably five times," Firkins said. "One of us could have been killed." The second attempt at euthanizing the sow was successful, Firkins said, but the experience taught him to always recommend that guns be used outdoors as often as possible. "If you need to do it inside, make sure there are as few people in the room as possible," Firkins said. "Also make sure you're a really good shot and that you position the gun close to the animal's head."

Whichever form or forms of euthanasia a producer chooses, it's important that the producer as well as any employees understand the farm's euthanasia protocol and receive training to perform the method of choice.

"Make sure all employees know that there's a clear plan and make sure they understand it," Firkins said. "Above all, make sure they feel comfortable with what they're doing."



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[Stacy]

Thanks Lesli. I was thinking maybe it'd be something like killing a rabbit for butcher, but none of those methods are suggested. Mike said he'll shoot it. Bummer. It was nice, lively little male! Uggh... But the kids, as they were crying about it, learned... if we're going to have a farm, sometimes the cute lil critters have to go too, because it's not nice to keep them in pain till they die on their own.

[Stacy]

Ok, so we can't count. At least not till we take a picture or two.
There's 12 live ones, one with a broken leg that they are still hoping to save, so that'd make it 13 live right now, and four dead. Poor thing! Now wonder she was soooo huge!

Steve, there's four reds in the pics, the broken legged one and the four dead were all red too, or some reddish type.





And here's an updated photo of Roses' piglets from a couple days earlier! They are getting big FASSSTTT!

[rezzfullacres]

WOW she was loaded with piglets!!!!! I always look to wean 10 or more per sow and I seem to do OK with them....One sugguestion is to install a raised floor for your sows to birth on..When they lay on wet ground, even with a straw bed they tend to get cold and have to get up and move and thereby increasing your chances of mishaps. We put down some landscape fabric, than about 4-6 inches of gravel, cover with sawdust and than lay down your straw. It makes a nice dry bedding area even if the rest of the pen is muddy as long as the top of the gravel is a couple of inches above the rest of the pen, we use a 2X6 as a ledger board, about 2/3 exposed on the down sidethan ramped to the lower grede. Most times the pigs won't soil the bedding area, even the piglets learn very quicky where the bathroom is. It looks like they all have wattles and even though the piglets are white you will be suprised at how red the meat is going to be.. Once again Congratulations and welcome to the wonderful world of pigs!!!!!!!!!

[Lesli]

Oh my GOODNESS!! OMG!! OMG!! I see baby wattles! Oh what cuteness!! awwwwe so sweet!

Lesli

[Stacy]

Thanks Lesli.

Good idea Steve. We have plenty of time now, till the next time they give birth. We can get a load of gravel here and get that done no problem. The pen that Bailey is in is getting totally scooped back to the ground level. I want all the "stuff" in there for my garden this year. But that'd give us a perfect time to build up that new place to birth.
How do you guarantee they'll birth where you build the bed though? What if she picks a different spot?
See any you like yet?

[Shelley (whistlingtrain)]

I think anything between 8 and 12 is a great litter size. Less seems like there could have been more, and more than 12 means worrying about them all eating enough, even if there are enough faucets.

Congratulations!!!

[Liz]

Beautiful piglets!!!!

[kristi]

I can't believe I only just saw this. Congrats on doing a fine job in crappy weather. I'm tickled your living babies are doing well and sorry you lost some. It happens, so don't beat yourself up. They look great!