~!!~ozarkjewels FARM RAID-Emily's Update

[yunta51]

Nov 1, 2010 6:21:11 GMT -5 Tammy said:

While I agree that we need to be familiar with what the law states, I respectfully disagree. Simply knowing the law and trying to comply will not keep one out of the courts. Not only with raw milk issues, but with most issues, one is no longer innocent until proven guilty. On the contrary, one is most often "guilty until proven innocent".

After going through a battle in court with my ex regarding health insurance on my son, knowing the whole time I had insurance on him but was accused otherwise, being almost arrested because the court itself sent out paperwork to me with one court date and they had down another date, and being treated as if I were the negligent, irresponsible parent by the system until I could prove otherwise, because my ex simply had a game he wanted to play, I can tell you without a doubt that knowing the law and even being compliant will not keep you out of trouble.

By the way, so confident was I of my own case, that I did not hire an attorney but represented myself in court and won. Something I would never do were I to go to court over raw milk issues.

Sorry if I took your message wrong, but while I agree that we need to be informed, I do not feel that often protects us. While I agree that taking on the government seems to be an effort in futility, what choice does one have when their entire life's work is being attacked and destroyed? Do you just walk away and start over with a different "life"? For me, farming is who I am as a person. I can't imagine leaving what I love and finding another way to exist. I can't imagine being in this family's shoes and having to make the decision to roll over and take what the government is dishing out, or try to fight it. I would hope that if I were in their place, that other folks would stand up for me and support my cause.
Tammy

I didn't say you or anyone else should "comply" with it. How can one comply with anything that limits their rights? The reason people are seen as guilty before innocent is because they're afraid in front of what they think of as an authority figure, but the agent is just another human being that has no more authority over you than you have of them. Your example of your ex shows how much grief one human can cause another in the court system. You can cause the same grief for anyone attempting to hassle you about anything you're doing that's lawful.

Being informed of the terms they're using is the only way to protect ourselves. Their case solely depends on the us not understanding the language (legalese) and then saying we "understand" the charges against us.

These agents have no superiors, they represent a fictional entity. This fictional entity in no "lawful" way can tell you what to do, unless you agree that the fictional entity is real and you recognize it by agreeing to anything the trespassing agents say.



Kevin

[Tammy]

Thank you for the clarification, Kevin. When I read your first post, I misunderstood your intentions. Now I understand better.

Pretty sure we are on the same page now!

Tammy

[yunta51]

Nov 1, 2010 8:10:08 GMT -5 Jenn said:

Maybe I'm reading this wrong too.

Morningland Dairy has been in business professionally and LEGALLY for over 30 years. This is not being run out of someone's kitchen. The Missouri Milk Board has a history of making ultimatums that have no legal basis.
-Jenn

A lot of this is new to me too, but I thought it would be good to get some dialog going at least, can't hurt anyway.

You say the dairy has been in business legally for over 30 years. The problem is that statutes and acts can be legally passed to shut them down by making them "illegal." Most people get a scared right away being associated with anything illegal. But illegal doesn't always mean you're doing something wrong or unlawful. One must never forget that when dealing with public servants. You're within your rights.

Kevin

[Jenn]

They are still fully legal.

The problem is the condemning of cheese that could be perfectly clean based on testing of cheese that may have been contaminated by a handler of the cheese after the raid in CA.

-Jenn

[yunta51]

I'm wondering if a private contract between the farmer and the buyer would stop any legal issue.

Kevin

[Tammy]

Local news coverage of Morningland Dairy

www.ky3.com/videobeta/3c4ff2d2-34c6-4f06-8b74-8842e2fe5b1d/News/Morningland-Dairy-ordered-to-destroy-cheese

[yunta51]

This is looking at it in legal terms. If the State gave an "order" to Morningland Dairy to destroy their cheese, then the dairy should give the State a "bill." It's no different than when you give a waiter an order and he brings you the bill. It's up to Morningland whether their cheese destroying fee is $200 an hour or $2000 an hour. This way they recoup any losses. and it's in accordance with the law.

Also in the video it says that the State said the cheese "must" be destroyed. The word "must" doesn't at all mean that you're obligated to do something. You only "must" do something if you wish to comply.

Unfortunately for Morningland, it looks like they will fight the State on it's own terms, which is impossible to win.

Kevin

[Janene]

I say nothing is impossible. Havoc has been created tying up their phone lines, emails and fax machine once already.
I say keep up the pressure and make them understand there are plenty of people behind Morningland supporting them.
Janene

[jerseymike]

Nov 4, 2010 11:12:42 GMT -5 yunta51 said:

This is looking at it in legal terms. If the State gave an "order" to Morningland Dairy to destroy their cheese, then the dairy should give the State a "bill." It's no different than when you give a waiter an order and he brings you the bill. It's up to Morningland whether their cheese destroying fee is $200 an hour or $2000 an hour. This way they recoup any losses. and it's in accordance with the law.

Also in the video it says that the State said the cheese "must" be destroyed. The word "must" doesn't at all mean that you're obligated to do something. You only "must" do something if you wish to comply.

Unfortunately for Morningland, it looks like they will fight the State on it's own terms, which is impossible to win.

Kevin

If you think fighting the state on it's own terms is a losing proposition try sending them a bill for "cheese destroying fee, it amounts to carrying water from a lake to a stream by the bucket full.

Unfortunately Morningland Dairy are not just a single cow mom and pop dairy, they are fairly large with a bunch of people that rely on a paycheck to survive and the longer this draws out the less the chances are that they can recoup.

IMHO, If it means cooperating with the state to get things moving again then that is what needs to be done at this time, but at the same time draw the attention of the general public so that there is an outcry at the way things were done by the state, the show of unconcern of state officials at a family's business, show them in the light of being the over bearing bully telling the hard working farmer what they have to do if they want to keep working, but most of all show that even though the Dairy complied with all of the rules and regulations and that all of the samples taken none have shown contamination, that's when people start to see this as an attack against the facility and not a "we're trying to save lives" campaign by the state.

Off my soapbox now,

Mike

[Janene]

I got this from Emily via e-mail today, and she said it was OK to post it for y'all:

I'd been offline for over a month and just got through about 2000 e-mails. Shew!!
I had just gotten around to answering e-mails and phone calls today.

I have been crazy busy just keeping the dairy farm running (its heavy calving season) and of course getting all the does bred and the herd and barn ready for winter. We have had several killing freezes already.

So I am not fully up on where we are and what we are doing. I do know we are at an impasse at the moment, them demanding we destroy all cheeses with no testing, and us asking that they let us test the cheese first at our expense. Although no one has ever been sick, we do not argue that it COULDN'T contain these bacterias. We just want to test BEFORE tossing all our savings down the drain!!!

If you want better and more up to date info, you might just keep checking our blog for updates from my mom.
There is great discussion going on at The Uncheese Party site which was started unbeknownst to me, by a friend in Northern Missouri. It has been a huge blessing for us to say the least! uncheeseparty.wordpress.com/
Prayers, letters to congressmen, representatives, etc, are all much appreciated. But number one is prayers that our nations eyes will be opened! "Land of the free" my foot!

Emily Dixon
Ozark Jewels

[yunta51]

Nov 5, 2010 1:31:37 GMT -5 jerseymike said:

If you think fighting the state on it's own terms is a losing proposition try sending them a bill for "cheese destroying fee, it amounts to carrying water from a lake to a stream by the bucket full.

Unfortunately Morningland Dairy are not just a single cow mom and pop dairy, they are fairly large with a bunch of people that rely on a paycheck to survive and the longer this draws out the less the chances are that they can recoup.

IMHO, If it means cooperating with the state to get things moving again then that is what needs to be done at this time, but at the same time draw the attention of the general public so that there is an outcry at the way things were done by the state, the show of unconcern of state officials at a family's business, show them in the light of being the over bearing bully telling the hard working farmer what they have to do if they want to keep working, but most of all show that even though the Dairy complied with all of the rules and regulations and that all of the samples taken none have shown contamination, that's when people start to see this as an attack against the facility and not a "we're trying to save lives" campaign by the state.

Off my soapbox now,

Mike

Well other people have provided the courts with a "bill for services" and walked away with money. Don't see why it would be different for the dairy.

If the defendants in this case can publicly state that the methods used for determining that the cheese was bad are "both incorrect and unscientific," than they could also publicly state that the Statutes used to go after their raw cheese were unlawful.

Kevin

[looking4jersey]

"he problem is that statutes and acts can be legally passed to shut them down by making them "illegal." Most people get a scared right away being associated with anything illegal. But illegal doesn't always mean you're doing something wrong or unlawful. One must never forget that when dealing with public servants. You're within your rights."

"Also in the video it says that the State said the cheese "must" be destroyed. The word "must" doesn't at all mean that you're obligated to do something. You only "must" do something if you wish to comply."

Kevin,

I think I am almost understanding your message. Are you saying that Morningland can continue to operate WITHOUT government blessing? That government doesn't have the right to shut down dairies? Or any other farming enterprise?

Wendy

[yunta51]

Your question is if they can still engage in comerce without being bothered by these pesky agents? I think it's possible. I don't know how the agents got ahold of their products in the first place, but I doubt it was lawful.

Do the agents have the right to shut them down? No. The public outcry attests to that. The governemnt never has had the right to shut down farms, that's why they create statutes. Knowing the legal jargon is the only way they can beat the bullies (that's what they are "bullies" since they have no authority over you really, they must result to bullying tactics to win).

Kevin

[stonehillfarm]

I for one, sent a letter to the Governor of Missouri and donated money to Morningland Dairy. I am just so sick of this tyrannical government from the TSA, the FBA, the USDA, on down!!!!! And I'm so annoyed when people talk about how free we are... that is until you do something that someone else thinks is bad for you. I mean for crying out loud, a woman can abort her baby, but we can't get raw milk cheese! I've bought morningland dairy's cheese before through Azure and loved it!

[Janene]

If you're not following the Uncheese blog, here's an interesting tidbit of facts from the Nov. 5th post from Doreen Hannes. (I've cut and copied pertinent parts--find the whole link below):
<snip>
The test results on the product seized from Rawesome by the CDFA (California Department of Food and Agriculture) show reports for two types of cheese attributed to Morningland Dairy.
<snip>
The first thing that strikes one as extremely odd about the reports is that neither one of them cite the name of the company in the product description. Secondly, there are no batch numbers for the cheese. These indicate the production date of food and help isolate potential problem areas. Thirdly, while they cite two types of cheese, there are two photocopies of the same one-pound block of Morningland Dairy Garlic Colby showing it’s weight as .87 lb. The only real information on the tests are the two types of cheese. One recorded as “raw milk Colby hot pepper” and the other as “raw milk cheese garlic”. Because of these oddities, I asked for the invoices for Rawesome’s purchases from Morningland prior to the June raid.
<snip>
The invoices reveal Rawesome purchased Morningland Dairy Hot Pepper Colby in ½ pound blocks, but there was no picture of this cheese with the CDFA lab report. The majority of cheese purchased by Rawesome from Morningland Dairy was goat cheese, which runs under Morningland’s Ozark Hills label. All cheeses invoiced to Rawesome were in ½ pound packages, and Morningland had sold no “Morningland Dairy Garlic Colby” to Rawesome, at all. So where did this one-pound block of Garlic Colby in the CDFA picture come from?
<snip>
Read the whole eye-opening post here:
uncheeseparty.wordpress.com/2010/11/05/it%e2%80%99s-all-suspect-let%e2%80%99s-destroy-it/

And I want to sincerely thank Sharon Zecchinelli, Doreen Hannes and Kimberly Hartke for all the hard work they've put into helping Morningland and the family.
Janene

[pipergrey93]

Thanks for calling this to everyone's attention Janene. It's so important that we all do our part to ensure we have access to real food without government interference. I'll be making a donation to Morningland in the name of 'JerseyMike'. I think he'd like that......Sandy

[sherrye]

sandy that is a wonderful idea i shall do the same in mikes name. sherrye

[Janene]

This was a new post as of Dec. 6th, I am just getting around to posting it here (for those not actively following the blog):

Morningland Dairy Gets Ready to Go to Court—
uncheeseparty.wordpress.com/blog-posts/
Janene

[sherrye]

thanks for the update janene

[Nora]

Dear Lord Jesus,,
I ask that you be with MorningLand Dairy in their fight against this outraige. The government is out of bounds and squashing its people in more ways than one. Please be with these people as they are dealing with this very stressful situation and may they have lots of courage. I pray that they will win and be compensated for their loss and hardship.
I just thank you Jesus for all the people supporting them with their financial gifts but also for their emotional support. May it continue until this is over with. Thats what true friends are for. Lord, you after all is our most true,loyal friend that can always be trusted, always their waiting for us to call upon you.
I pray that your will be done in this situation and the grace to go on, for when things dont turn out as we would like,, for we also know that in the end you turn all things for good to those who love you. Lord, we trust that you know what is best for us even when we dont
Amen.

My heart goes out to all who are in this fight and similar ones. Our freedoms are at stake. I do love my raw,healthy products. I would hate to have to give up my cow.